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Post by hellocontrol on Aug 17, 2014 14:05:15 GMT
I understand that the train staff have voted to have two strikes 22nd August and the 17th September. All due to management treatment of staff or lack of.
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Post by GentlemanJim on Aug 19, 2014 9:00:28 GMT
I understand that the train staff have voted to have two strikes 22nd August and the 17th September. All due to management treatment of staff or lack of. In all probability local issues getting out of hand due to disinterested management who rarely listen. It really is about time the Directors of LU nip this in the bud, letting these issues get to this stage is a real sign of weakness on the part of local Managers. www.lbc.co.uk/central-line-train-drivers-to-strike-95631
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Post by hellocontrol on Aug 19, 2014 15:28:32 GMT
I know that other lines have had local issues but the higher up management like you say just sit back. I know some years ago when there was going to be a system wide strike by drivers management had a list of all duty managers who were previously were drivers they then asked if they would be prepared to drive trains in service, I know I was one that was asked.
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Post by railtechnician on Aug 21, 2014 15:58:59 GMT
I know that other lines have had local issues but the higher up management like you say just sit back. I know some years ago when there was going to be a system wide strike by drivers management had a list of all duty managers who were previously were drivers they then asked if they would be prepared to drive trains in service, I know I was one that was asked. One would hope that you would have all refused on principle but more importantly due to Licensing restrictions. I recall the signal operators going on strike at Earls Court and the signal desks being manned by managers, they were not only not Licensed but had also never held a signal operator or AET/Technical Officer post either. My recollection is that there was possibly one senior manager in the room with some form of qualification who was going to act as 'supervisor' for the others. Some drivers and other staff were also on strike, fortunately there were not more than a handful of trains about. In my experience many in middle management seemed completely oblivious to the concepts of management incompetence at best and the potential for culpable homicide at worst which might reasonably be levelled at them in the event of an incident. Most never seemed to grasp that they could be gambling their careers, livelihood and freedom by wearing hats that they were neither qualified nor 'currently' licensed to wear. Personally if it was wrong and I knew it to be so I would refuse to do it on the grounds of 'reasonable suspicion of potential breach of H&S' and/or potential breach of other applicable rules, regulations and procedures. However, I never refused to work as that could/would be construed as gross misconduct. I would of course always be willing to do any work, even that which I reasonably believed to be a breach of rules, regulations and procedures as long as I was given an order to that effect in writing, witnessed by an independent third party. Strangely no such orders were ever issued to me and I remained true to my principles even as a manager. Strikes in my opinion are a complete waste of time, nobody wins in a strike and the passengers get very upset and rightly so for what it costs them to be treated like sheep when travelling to and from work when trains are running. The staff of course are the ones in the firing line, not the management. Working to rule is the proper way to solve a dispute but the unions don't like it because, according to my old RMT rep, "the staff don't know the rules"!
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Post by hellocontrol on Aug 22, 2014 7:02:46 GMT
You are right strikes don't normally solve anything look at what happened over "Action Stations" everyone thought we won all management did was rename it "Company Plan". With working to rule the unions don't like it because there is a service running, well that was the attitude when I was involved in the union. I was a assistant branch secretary with ASLEF and some of the things we talked about without the members in attendance, I was on District council as well. I decided to pack it in as a result.
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Post by hellocontrol on Aug 22, 2014 7:44:47 GMT
When I was asked if I would drive during the strike I said no I would only drive if there was an emergency driver taken ill etc. I remember during one strike when the control room staff went out there was a number of IMRs worked by duty managers none of which had any proper training.
During strikes if there was no service and there were staff about things like track walks were done so staff could be familarised I even found a certificate with my name which had been filled in by someone else who I challenged he said he did not think I would see it I took it higher but knowing what the senior managers were like well you can guess.
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Post by Nortube on Aug 22, 2014 14:10:06 GMT
Central line status at 15:07 "Central Line: Due to strike action, no service between Epping and White City and between Woodford and White City via Hainault with SEVERE DELAYS on the rest of line." W&C status at 15:07 "Waterloo and City Line: No service due to strike action." So it's not suspended then?
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Post by hellocontrol on Aug 22, 2014 14:20:06 GMT
I think we all know what propaganda senior management put out no service sounds a lot better than suspended.
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Post by railtechnician on Aug 22, 2014 19:59:59 GMT
When I was asked if I would drive during the strike I said no I would only drive if there was an emergency driver taken ill etc. I remember during one strike when the control room staff went out there was a number of IMRs worked by duty managers none of which had any proper training. During strikes if there was no service and there were staff about things like track walks were done so staff could be familarised I even found a certificate with my name which had been filled in by someone else who I challenged he said he did not think I would see it I took it higher but knowing what the senior managers were like well you can guess. I agree that emergencies are a special case and I don't think anyone with commonsense and a sense of responsibility would disagree. As for duty managers in IMRs, they are not allowed to work frames without a Technical Officer in attendance unless the frame could be worked normally by a signal operator because it is separate 'room' from the IMR e.g. Ealing Broadway DR or Kings Cross Picc IMRs. A manager (other than signals) in an IMR could cause all sorts of havoc if straying outside the yellow lined pathway and having seen some managers in action I would certainly never trust one to be in an IMR unaccompanied by a suitably licensed chaperon. In any event an operating manager cannot officially work an IMR frame without instructions in real time from a signal operator! Even a signalling Technical Officer cannot work an IMR frame in traffic hours without instructions from a signal operator. It usually takes more than one TO too, the last time I was present and we had to work the frame at Acton East there were three of us including the person manning the phone! Of course as long as things are running smoothly one TO in reach of the phone can man a frame but things can quickly go pear shaped if a lever isn't normalised quickly enough. Then pressure can build !
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Post by hellocontrol on Aug 23, 2014 7:54:28 GMT
Can't disagree with you some of the duty managers were just sucking up to the senior managers. At that time none of them had a sort of training and most did not really understand anyway. Afterwards they sent a lot of duty managers on familiarisation courses, key courses I think it was equipment room awareness IIRC. I observed at one IMR a duty manager question what the T/O said he changed his mind very quickly when the T/O said you had better leave then.
I remember another duty manager (ex signalman) who drove a train after the T/Op had been taken ill he thought there is nothing to driving a train so he carried on until he had a spad.
There are several very senior managers who did things such as drive trains when they were not even qualified they were guards and as such should only have driven in an emergency but the train was kept in service, another one when he was a guard always came to work under the influence.
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Post by Nortube on Aug 28, 2014 11:38:05 GMT
Next Central line strike announced for 17 September [ Click Here ]
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