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Post by trammedic on Mar 30, 2013 22:11:34 GMT
Many early stocks carried candles in a small glass-fronted cupboard let in to the bulkhead. On another site the question has been raised: who lit them!?
Has anyone here had to do this, and under what circumstances?
Cheers, Tony, Portsmouth
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Post by Nortube on Mar 30, 2013 23:00:19 GMT
38 stock used to have them, although they were no longer in use when I joined in 1973. I forget where the candle holders were located in the car - I suspect near the doors. I'm assuming it was the Guard's job to light them when necessary, although it may have been the Guard at his end of the train and the Motorman at the other. I assume that a stock of candles and matches were kept in the toolbox in the cabs.
Even when I came on the job, the use of candles seemed unthinkable. All I can think of is that it was possibly a design hangover from earlier stock when train back-up batteries weren't reliable, or they weren't used for emergency lighting at the time, or possibly batteries improved over the years and thus the candles were no longer needed.
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Post by railtechnician on Mar 31, 2013 7:20:35 GMT
38 stock used to have them, although they were no longer in use when I joined in 1973. I forget where the candle holders were located in the car - I suspect near the doors. I'm assuming it was the Guard's job to light them when necessary, although it may have been the Guard at his end of the train and the Motorman at the other. I assume that a stock of candles and matches were kept in the toolbox in the cabs. Even when I came on the job, the use of candles seemed unthinkable. All I can think of is that it was possibly a design hangover from earlier stock when train back-up batteries weren't reliable, or they weren't used for emergency lighting at the time, or possibly batteries improved over the years and thus the candles were no longer needed. Strange, I had similar thoughts about the red paraffin lamps still carried on the rear of stock when I joined in 1977. It seemed really odd for a train running on electricity and having batteries on board needed a red filter paraffin lamp on the last car, why not electric lamps? It must have been in the early 1980s with the demise of 38 stock and District stock that the practice ceased. Cupboards under stairs at many open section stations were lamp stores and as we discovered when surveying locations to install longline PA racks most still had a large amount of paraffin lamps to be carried on the backs of trains and perhaps also as red lights for station emergencies.
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Post by Nortube on Mar 31, 2013 10:26:51 GMT
I'd forgotten about the oil lamps. Smelly things when you were trying to kip on a train at nights, but they added to the atmosphere! I may be wrong, but I had the feeling that the 59 stock stabling lights were retro-fitted at some point. The position of the ordinary toggle light switch always seemed a bit Heath Robinson. It probably was due to the batteries.
On 38 stock, gassing batteries was a known defect and it was not uncommon to walk through a train and smell the distinctive 'bad eggs' aroma of the sulphur. This could be very strong on a severely gassing battery that was getting hot. Gassing batteries were generally rarer on 59 stock and almost unheard of on 72 stock.
The batteries on 38 stock never seemed to hold their charge very well and it wasn't unusual to walk through a train during depot prep on a pit road to find the emergency lights very dim in the middle car(s) that had had no leads in since stabling. It could be the same on a leading car that had only just been pulled up onto juice before the driver got on the train. The MGs were tripped as part of the test and the driver would get an audible warning as the (weak) battery took over. The defect was easily confirmed by checking the cab / emergency lights to see if they were normal or dim. The driver would blow up for a fitter and would be told "don't worry, they'll charge up on the road" and he would set the MGs so the normal 50v was restored.
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Post by Nortube on Apr 1, 2013 14:25:03 GMT
Whilst digging through some old circulars, I found one for the Northern line - No.18 1951. This stated: "It is intended, as far as practicable, to dispose with the use of oil lamps for such purposes as tail lamps, hand lamps, etc. on London Transport trains......"
This was to commence on the Northern line from Sunday 20 May 1951. Oil tail lights were still to be used for train protection when stabled or in emergency. No specific reason is given for the change.
The circular also shows the 22 'dice' head light code variations for the Northern line destinations.
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Post by tubetroll on Apr 1, 2013 23:39:00 GMT
I never worked on the 1938s except in heritage trips, but i do have one of the emergency candle holders in my collection. And I also have a copy of traffic circular supplement 19 of 1967 detailing the introduction of Bardic lamps to the underground (remember the powder blue ones?) They are still in use by many drivers 46 years later!
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Post by Nortube on Apr 2, 2013 11:57:00 GMT
The problem with the Bardics is that they have a weak point in the switch. The handlamp is robust enough and you can throw it around, drop it, and do virtually anything with it (even the bulb seems to survive), but the switch is a poor design. Some years ago I used to repair them. The parts would be ordered from Bardic (if the company was still called that). I gave up in the end as there were too many of them. I think that company wide, a lot of expensive Bardics got thrown away because of the switch.
The replacement plastic (LED) handlamps that were issued were much better and easier to carry, but they also had a design fault where, when the batteries were put in the retaining clip at the ends got bent back and thus loss contact nd the handlamp rarely worked after a battery change. More wasted money, and then the Bardics were brought back.
I remember the powder blue ones, I think I used to have one at some point.
Stations rarely seemed to be supplied with handlamps, the 'green' for the last train was usually a wave from somebody on the platform.
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Post by WLX568 on Apr 2, 2013 12:41:47 GMT
Bardic became part of Chloride at some point. I remember there were converters to allow a Bardic to run on 3-off 'D' size batteries instead of the conventional Bardic battery.
My converter however met it's end when I used the handlamp as a hammer!
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Post by Nortube on Apr 2, 2013 12:59:41 GMT
The battery converters are still available. I think Maplin stock the bog standard 3 x D cell holders, or they can be bought elsewhere.
Depot staff used to have rechargeable packs in their handlamps (they may still do if they still have Bardics)
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Post by railtechnician on Apr 2, 2013 13:20:20 GMT
Bardic became part of Chloride at some point. I remember there were converters to allow a Bardic to run on 3-off 'D' size batteries instead of the conventional Bardic battery. My converter however met it's end when I used the handlamp as a hammer! Ah the things that hamdlamps were used for! When I began with LT the signal supervisors had the original Ever Ready grey Spacebeam lamps with the large metal battery, used to quickly check track circuit opposition and the integrity of blockjoint failure indicators. I modified my own Spacebeam with a couple of banana sockets and used it to pick up delta track relays. When we used to use Tilley lamps before the issue of torches they were very handy as heaters especially in the winter, when I was working out at Cockfosters in the temporary relay room in the first months of 1979 on day shift I used to take my Tilley lamp and put it under the chair I was sitting on while wiring fuse bays and relay racks. That winter was so bad it snowed into April and the temporary relay room was a draughty wooden hut which we'd cut large holes into for cable entries! I recall the Bardics with D cells, I used to carry one when on the track in the evenings with my installation gang after the tricolour oil lamps were withdrawn.
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