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Post by dave1 on Aug 10, 2016 15:59:13 GMT
Came across this Thames news The shot at the beginning of what looks like an operations person would they really operate this sort of equipment.
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drico
Station Inspector
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Posts: 202
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Post by drico on Aug 10, 2016 16:51:33 GMT
Think this was staged for the news report. Pumpmen were part of the lifts and escalators department and wore overalls.
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Post by railtechnician on Aug 10, 2016 20:00:37 GMT
Think this was staged for the news report. Pumpmen were part of the lifts and escalators department and wore overalls. I'm not so sure it was staged, I would expect station supervisors to have something to do with some aspects of pump equipment just as they have something to do with fire equipment and emergency medical equipment ! L&E pumps staff were not station based, thus the station supervisor could be the first person on site able to do anything useful usually closely followed by the signal lineman who took first call on all engineering equipment !
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Post by dave1 on Aug 13, 2016 6:57:49 GMT
Was this person a station supervisor his hat makes him look more authoritative.
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Post by Nortube on Aug 13, 2016 9:46:03 GMT
It's hard to see because of the few seconds he's shown and the angle that he is, but by the look of the scrambled egg on his cap he (or at least his cap) appears to be a higher grade, such as groupie / area manager etc. However, I can't remember groupies / AMs ever wearing grey. Their uniform was usually black.
I was wondering if the tunnel shown in the clip was the C&SLRly tunnel. The lower of the two tunnels under the Thames was often flooded high enough so that normal walking through them was not possible, although I suspect that this was usually due to equipment failure.
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Post by hellocontrol on Aug 13, 2016 10:27:27 GMT
Was this person a station supervisor his hat makes him look more authoritative. He is a duty manager and as has been said the station supervisor would have knowledge and understanding, they all did on my stations.
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Post by hellocontrol on Aug 13, 2016 10:29:28 GMT
Think this was staged for the news report. Pumpmen were part of the lifts and escalators department and wore overalls. If you waited for L&E pumps you could wait sometime in later years all the pumps were monitored so they would normally know of problems although they would wait to send someone once informed.
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Post by railtechnician on Aug 13, 2016 10:53:40 GMT
Was this person a station supervisor his hat makes him look more authoritative. I don't know, I seldom paid attention to later uniform hats unless they had scrambled egg on them, those people it was a pleasure to give directions to when up to one's neck dealing with a signal failure, the only time that one might legally do so without fear, the signal lineman being the senior hat so to speak. The chap in the video might've been a DSM or GSM at the time simply doing a routine station asset inspection or alternatively a random safety inspection. I suggested station supervisor simply because they were expected, and I presume still are expected, to be familiar with the station they were in charge of, that being so whether permanent or relief supervisors. More than a few times I accompanied station supervisors when doing nightly inspections as a way of familiarising myself with the geography to establish cable routes between different levels, learn the locations of unfamiliar engineering rooms that I had not visited before etc. Of course following the Kings Cross Fire before the new fire detection and suppression systems were installed it was necessary to patrol every 'section 12' station every hour checking every engineering room and then it was all hands to the pump, anyone operations, engineering whether frontline or office based could be checking engineering rooms as long as they were keyholders or were deemed suitable to be keyholders. I had a few weeks of that myself on day shift covering groups of three stations and it wasn't always easy to get all the rooms at all the stations checked within an hour. While doing the 8 hour Turnpike Lane, Wood Green and Bounds Green tour, towards the end of my shift I arrived eastbound at Wood Green to make the last hourly checks there as the running SM office staff were evacuating themselves to the street because the station was on fire! As I climbed one escalator to the ticket hall as the last man leaving the platforms the LFB were coming down the one that had smoke emitting from below. The signal report centre was none to pleased when I phoned to say that I would be unable to do my last hourly check at Bounds Green and was booking off as it was the end of my shift.
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Post by railtechnician on Aug 14, 2016 10:39:20 GMT
Think this was staged for the news report. Pumpmen were part of the lifts and escalators department and wore overalls. If you waited for L&E pumps you could wait sometime in later years all the pumps were monitored so they would normally know of problems although they would wait to send someone once informed. Yep in the late 1980s and early 1990s all lifts, escalators and pumps were remotely monitored. The data was sent via dial up modems over normal LUL internal telephone lines. AFAIR this was often done over the escalator UMC auto telephone circuit if dedicated lines had not been installed. Thus a telephone left off hook or other telephone fault on the line or in the exchange could prevent data being sent or received. These days I would imagine that like many other systems remote monitoring is done over LULs Intranet. For a while I did quite a lot of work related to sumps & pumps as the comms and signals sections always ran all the monitoring and control cabling from the water level detectors and pumps to the pump control cabinets. Back in the day sumps and pumps were monitored in the station operations rooms and line or other control rooms for non-station locations, these being visual and audible alarms on the telephone panels. For example Northfields pumps were monitored on the Piccadilly Line Controller's telephone panel while those for Northumberland Park were monitored on the depot shunter's telephone panel. I presume the remote monitoring via telephone lines was done from the L&E Report Centre but I never worked on the control end of those circuits. These days I would expect sumps & pumps to be monitored by whatever the modern name for the NOC/NCC is these days but I don't know if that is the case.
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drico
Station Inspector
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Posts: 202
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Post by drico on Aug 14, 2016 16:46:49 GMT
NOC/NCC is now the London Underground Control Centre, is in a building near Southwalk station.
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Post by railtechnician on Aug 15, 2016 1:17:19 GMT
NOC/NCC is now the London Underground Control Centre, is in a building near Southwalk station. Yes perhaps but I wonder why the name was changed to that which is little better than the original and its successor i.e. LU Couldn't Care ! Something similar to pre NCC days might be more fitting e.g. LU Control HQ I presume that's a typo and you mean Southwark.
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drico
Station Inspector
Thank you driver, off clips.
Posts: 202
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Post by drico on Aug 15, 2016 17:16:32 GMT
NOC/NCC is now the London Underground Control Centre, is in a building near Southwalk station. Yes perhaps but I wonder why the name was changed to that which is little better than the original and its successor i.e. LU Couldn't Care ! Something similar to pre NCC days might be more fitting e.g. LU Control HQ I presume that's a typo and you mean Southwark. Yes it's a typo.
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Post by dave1 on Aug 16, 2016 14:17:52 GMT
Yes perhaps but I wonder why the name was changed to that which is little better than the original and its successor i.e. LU Couldn't Care ! Something similar to pre NCC days might be more fitting e.g. LU Control HQ I presume that's a typo and you mean Southwark. Yes it's a typo. That building is across the road from Southwark station. Here is an early mention of it. Palestraand here is an article with photos and there is also a signal box shown further down. LUCC
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Post by dave1 on Aug 16, 2016 14:20:17 GMT
I have looked a few more times and appears to me that the guy is either holding the wheel for the photo or is operating it and I think it may be a valve?
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Post by railtechnician on Aug 18, 2016 0:45:24 GMT
That building is across the road from Southwark station. Here is an early mention of it. Palestraand here is an article with photos and there is also a signal box shown further down. LUCCSince when have there been 14 lines? So NCC, MICC, PIR, TAC, PCR are all there alongside Bus and Streets controls, I guess it must be okay to talk about BDY, LSQ, SKN these days then. £25 million for a rented floor to house those facilities if I understand the article correctly but one has to wonder what the annual rent and maintenance charges are. LUL owns property throughout the capital and with modern technology all systems in use can be remotely monitored anywhere in one or multiple locations so why spend fortunes renting a floor of a modern eyesore when LUL could have built a purpose built central control room. No doubt Palestra is just a temporary home like many previous ones and in a few years everything will be shunted somewhere else probably when technology has advanced a little further. Such has been the LT/LU pattern over the last century. The 12000 cameras is interesting, I actually wonder how many can be monitored simultaneously these days, the BTP used to only have access to 7 cameras simultaneously and not more than two from the same line. It was, however, able to monitor every camera on every station like the local station ops rooms and unlike the line control rooms which generally only got headwall and tail wall or midway platform pictures. Unless technology has moved on apace I expect there is still a finite limit to the number of simultaneous cameras that can be viewed on a single line. I expect the old analogue longline CCTV has been upgraded to digital, there used to be two channels per line for the line control room and two allocated for BTP but generally only one installed, the Victoria line was split north and south of Cobourg St such that it could monitor two channels in each direction, later technology allowed the Vic to have 8 channels and the system I installed on the west end of the Picc from Heathrow to Earls Court and 55 Broadway was an 8 channel system but only equipped for 3 channels in the late 1980s. Back then a station was limited to 20 cameras. I recall Oxford Circus as being one of the first stations to have the newer local CCTV systems which were computer controlled and allowed up to 512 cameras maximum although nowhere near than many were installed. I expect a practical working maximum for most stations these days is 50 cameras, obviously more than than for the busier central London interchanges and less than that for stations in outer London.
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